Content is King. Regardless of the platform.

Want to scale on TikTok? You’re only as good as your content.

Want to step up your IG game? Content, baby.

Want to finally scale on YouTube? Hire OMG (ha!) and create great content!

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Today I’m interviewing Danil Saliukov, CEO and Co-Founder of Insense. I met Danil when we both spoke at Geek Out in San Diego a few months ago.

Insense is a marketplace that connects creators with brands and facilitates the creation of great content.

Creating great content comes down to 3 things:

1. Find the right creator for your brand
2. Build authentic content that highlights why your product is great
3. Create content specifically geared toward the platforms you want to run on

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Here’s a look at what we breakdown on the show:

• Where brands go wrong when creating content for marketing - Not every creator is an influencer, and not every influencer is a creator.
• What separates brands that do really well from the rest?
• The key to finding creators that best fit a brand.
• How brands can help creators create great content.
• How brands should approach TikTok.
• Actors vs. content creators vs. real customers for UGC.

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Mentioned in This Episode:

Danil Saliukov

   - LinkedIn ‍

Insense‍

Insense’s Blog‍

Nick Shackelford’s Twitter

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Transcript:

Brett:

Well, hello and welcome to another edition of the eCommerce Evolution podcast. I'm your host, Brett Curry, CEO of OMG Commerce, and today we're talking about scaling your eCommerce brand with creators and UGC content. Really, some of my favorite video content is u GC and content that creators crank out. And so we're going deep. Uh, my guest today is the CEO and co-founder of Incense, which you'll hear about in just a minute. And we, his name is, uh, Daniel, uh, Soloff. I may have just butchered that. We're gonna, we're gonna confirm that in one minute, Daniel. Uh, but I first met Daniel at Geek out in San Diego, Uh, one of Nick Shackleford events. We hit it off. I was really impressed with what Daniel had to share, and so I'm like, Hey, you gotta come on the podcast and talk creator content ugc. So, Daniel, welcome to the show, man. Thanks for taking the time. And how badly did I butcher your last name?

Danil:

<laugh>? Not bad at all. Uh, thanks so much, Brett, uh, for inviting me to the podcast.

Brett:

Yeah, absolutely. Really excited to have you here. And, uh, wanted dive right in because we got a lot of good stuff to talk about here. Uh, I, I think most people listening know the power of UGC and the power of creators, but, but really, you know, how we get UGC and how do we partner with creators? It's, it's kind of complex and, and it is time consuming and it's scary, and we don't know where to begin sometimes. So, uh, before we get into some of the how-tos and tips and advice and strategies, first, tell everybody what is incense and, you know, what problem do you guys exist to solve?

Danil:

Yeah. Uh, incense, uh, is a creator marketplace that helps, uh, e-commerce brands to get fresh, authentic content from, uh, creators, basically user generative content. And then, uh, they can apply that like in Facebook ads or TikTok ads and running the campaigns and seeing like, great performance. And the problem we solve is that the content production is not scalable. It's not easy. And to find the right creators for your brand, it's, it's not easy as well as like to negotiate with them, to pitch with them, and like also to send the payments. So we basically one stop shop, uh, to solve that. And, uh, in the end of the day, he comes owners and marketers that they can scale profits with that.

Brett:

Love it. And, and what's beautiful about this is when you get the right piece of content, the right creator saying the right things with the right tone and the right personality, and they say something about your brand, and it's just super powerful, and you then leverage that across all your channels, that's so valuable for your business. The trouble is, yeah, how do you find the right person and how do you pay them and how do you coach them, and how do you coordinate all of that? It just becomes really, really difficult. And so your platform does that. It's a marketplace. It matches brands and creators together. And so more about that coming up. We're gonna dig into to more about Incen. I know people have questions and wanna know about incense. Uh, but let's, let's dive in a little bit and let's, let's get tactical, let's get strategic for brands here. Where, where do brands often go wrong in the content creation process?

Danil:

Great question. Uh, I would say, uh, many brands, they don't have like a lot of experience working with the new social platforms and like new social reality, like Instagram involved, like from the, just the photo sharing service, right? To the video first platform. And right now they're shifting to the creator first platform because of TikTok, because TikTok is a cra creator first platform, right? And, uh, many, uh, marketers, they kind of, they stayed in the world of like static images and, uh, don't get me wrong, like static images, still performing the real grade, but depends on the funnel, Like what it like depends on the product, depends on the, like, uh, offering and so on, so on. So like, so many like little things. And I think like one of the key is like, uh, many marketers, they still, uh, producing a lot of static images instead of like, uh, producing both video content and, uh, static images.

That's number one. The second one, they are, they're treating all social platforms, uh, equally meaning that, okay, what is gonna be working on Instagram? I'm gonna repurpose on TikTok and it's gonna be performing the same. Now, it's not like it's way different platforms, and we have seen like a lot of success, like over repurposing like TikTok content, like in Instagram reel, for instance, but like, not for, uh, Instagram feed. So, and that's like a small nuances that, uh, marketers are doing, uh, are not realizing that. Um, and the last thing, So sometimes they, they don't have, they don't have like a understanding of the platforms and the new concept concept, which is the ugly, the better, meaning that your content doesn't need to be like, super polished, right? So you are not lal, you don't have like these crazy brain guidelines. You should be like more flexible. And, uh, sometimes the content should be like, way great, nice looking, It should be like performing in the of the day. So many marketers, they still, uh, have this approach, uh, and it doesn't work. Uh, and it's not really scalable then

Brett:

Love it. So the uglier the better. Why, why do you think that is? I've got, I've got a theory and, and obviously there, there are, sometimes there are ads that are polished that work great, but, but in a lot of cases, the uglier the better. Why is that?

Danil:

Uh, because of the new platforms, Because of new generations of people, right? So the way how we consume the content, the way how, uh, like next generations are consuming the content. So, uh, it's, uh, popcorn content, right? So like, just a few six seconds, even if it's like, it's not fun, if it's not related to me, then like skip swipe and forget it forever, right? Yeah. So like, that's why right now, uh, you need to be, first of all, explain about your product, explain your, uh, your idea of the advertising, like within the first like 1, 2, 3 seconds, up to three seconds. Uh, that's one thing. Secondly, because of when I see like, my, uh, feet on TikTok or Instagram in stories, even though I see like my friend, like jumping in from the second floor to the pool, right? And like, it's something craziness has happen there. Yeah. And imagine that you see the content, which is like filmed by professional production studios in, uh, like some mountains in Utah, right? So like, and it just like, why I see here that like, uh, I, I'm ready to see that in TV commercials, right? And I'm expecting that, but I don't want to see that. I want to see like something crazy, something that is not gonna be like, so outstanding in my feet. So that's why the ugly the better.

Brett:

I love it. And I think I wanna touch on a couple things. You mentioned, uh, one, one thing that you didn't necessarily mention exactly, but but you implied it for sure, is, you know, being authentic, authenticity is so important, and that's important on every platform, but authenticity looks different on different platforms, right? You talked about how TikTok and Instagram reels, they're pretty similar, right? That's a similar concept. You could probably have the same piece of content work on Instagram reels, also work on TikTok. Uh, you know, we, we do a lot with YouTube at our agency. Occasionally we'll have a client who has the same ad video ad that runs on Facebook, also run on YouTube, but usually not, usually they're quite a bit different. And so if you, if you think about what's happening on TikTok or what's happening on Instagram, you're seeing a lot of raw content, right?

Content from average people. And then when you see something highly polished as you're scrolling through, it immediately screams, this is an ad, this is stilted, this is fake, right? It doesn't feel authentic, it doesn't feel real. Uh, I think this is, this is one of the reasons why if we look at YouTube ads, sometimes actually a little more polished or a little highly produc, more highly produced, does work well there, because there's a lot of YouTube content that's put together, right? Some of your favorite content creators, like, Hey, dude, or dude dad, or, I'm not sure why I'm stuck on dude here, uh, right at the moment. But, but other, other channels on, on, uh, on YouTube, they're a little more polished or a little more put together, feels a little more like tv. So, uh, a slightly higher level of, of production value can work really well on YouTube. It doesn't work well on other platforms, right? And, and I love that you underscored know what the platform is all about, right? Instagram started as a photo sharing platform, and now it's video sharing, and there are lots of travel, so you got all kinds of, you know, landscape photos and travel photos and stuff like that. So that type of content is gonna feel authentic and feel natural as well. So, uh, really love that. Anything, uh, anything else you'd add to that? Um, or should we move on?

Danil:

Yeah, I would adhere. So like, you do expect like, some Polish content, like, uh, on YouTube for sure, because like, that's the nature of the platform. And if you'll see like, uh, the best, uh, creators there, if you, if you don't have like a professional production, somehow professional production, right? Like a good sound, like, uh, all of this stuff, then basically, I'm not sure that you're gonna be successful, like, on the platform. Yeah. So it might be like a bit of shaky, It might be not looks like a tv tv, right? Because it's not tv, it's YouTube, it's different, but like, yeah, I would agree. And like, really depends on the platform. So Facebook or Facebook is way different from Instagram. Instagram is, uh, Instagram basically is like three apps right now. Like, it was Instagram as Instagram, it was like Instagram, which is like Snapchat stories. And right now it's, uh, Instagram, which is reals, which is TikTok, right? So like, that's why like, Instagram is the most complicated and there is a TikTok, right? And like, all of these platforms are really different, and that's why like, you need to approach them like differently. And finding the right creators, some of the creators who are really great, uh, in producing the content, um, that resonates to their audience, like on Instagram, doesn't mean that, uh, this creator will produce the same style content for TikTok. Nah, <laugh>, and

Brett:

Exactly, Yeah. Finding the right creator for the platform is so important. And so I want, I wanna dive into that a little bit. Oh, and one, just one thing point of clarification on, on the YouTube side, what another we found actually is sometimes you can start low production value on YouTube. We have lots of clients that start there, or a mix of high production value with ugc. Mix those two together, right? That some real magic on YouTube, which is great. Um, so let's talk about this for just a minute. You know, I think a lot of people are wondering, Hey, do I need to hire a, a creator? Do I need to go out and find an actor? Do I just need true ugc? So u GC from actual customers, how would you talk about that? Like, how would you kind of compare creator to actor to customer?

Danil:

Yeah, it's a great question. Uh, there is a like, company called VI Media. They're like, Yeah, shout out to them. Shout

Brett:

To those guys. High energy, handlebar, mustache. Cody's always rocking a, a sweet shirt. Um, kinda like, I don't know if, if you've seen the movie, um, Ocean's 11, but, but someone says to Brad Pitt's character, they're like, Why you always dressing like a jilo? And that's, that's how I feel about Cody. Uh, but, but Cody's an awesome guy. I love that guy so much, so Oh, so good. Yeah,

Danil:

Yeah, yeah. And the, the best part, like their, uh, creative scientist, I would put like that. So like, they know what the creators should be like, like consist from, right? So like every single part of that. So they put like a lot of thought there. And like, I love their presentations, like on geek out. Like, I'm sitting there and I'm just like lowering like every single day, right? So like, best guys and why I, why I brought them. So they, uh, the nature of, uh, their business, so like their production studio, right? Like really high quality, and they put like a lot of science there. And, uh, they have like a, a lot of actors. So people who are acting like for the creating u GC style content, uh, it's well scripted, right? But then, uh, what we absorb with them, so we are partners with VI media.

So for Instagram, for instance, like this scripted videos and actors, they, they do work like really well. But for TikTok, no. And that's why like they're studying heavily using incense, uh, for producing like a lot of TikTok. And, uh, then like you, you creating, like, as you mentioned before, like on YouTube, actually, it works like, uh, across all platforms. So something professional, branded content mixed up with the u c, that's the one like that is works like really great. So that's why, like, I don't want to say like, you know, uh, who is the, who's the best, who is the worst? Like in terms of the actors or like, uh, creators and so on. I think like it's, uh, really depends on your goals, right? So sometimes like actors, they can deliver your message like in a really great way. Um, as well as like creators, uh, as well as just like regular people.

I think what what's really important, it's, uh, still be authentic. Yes. So actors, they need to understand your product. They need to try that. If it's coffee, drink this coffee. If it's like some like, I don't know, like, uh, massage machine, then like, try this. Like, just, just before the shooting, just try, just, just have some experience. In that case, you can deliver your message like in proper way. So that's why, uh, this one is really important. And then, like, uh, actors, they're really great, uh, in front of the camera creators. Depends, right? So, uh, someone they acting like really great, someone that still learning, right? With the, uh, just, uh, just your customers. That's the worst part. Select many of them, unfortunately, they can, they don't know how to act, uh, in front of the camera. They don't have like legit sound and so on. So that's why like, this part is tricky one though. They have, uh, the most loyal to your brand if they agree to, uh, shoot some EGC style content. So that's why like, there is a balance between the equality, authenticity, and like, um, if you try this product or not, right? So like, that's why it's really depends on your goals. But I will say, uh, mix this up and see what is it gonna be like the best result for you.

Brett:

Yeah, I love it. And in the way that I would kind of break this down, uh, I've always really, really enjoyed authentic customer testimonials when the customers using their own words. But that's difficult, right? So what I've found, and I've, I used to do TV back in the day, and so I, I've been in, in dozens and dozens of interviews with real customers. We had to like chop up and use for TV ads in other places. But what I found is you can't give a customer a script. You give a customer a script, they all of a sudden become wooden and st most of them wooden and stiff, and it just sounds like fake. So with a, with a customer, you just gotta let them speak and usually ask them questions to kinda get them going. And then you're gonna have to do some editing.

You have to do some editing and chopping and, you know, maybe someone talks for three minutes and you use 10 seconds of that, right? But when somebody says something that's authentic and raw and real, it can be a, a magical, you know, bit of video with a, with an actor, the right actor, you can give him a script, right? You can say, I want you to say exactly this thing, and that can work. Although, you know, people can sniff out if something feels authentic or not, right? Just like watching a good movie and you're like, Nah, not buying it. I don't, I'm not feeling anything when I watch that character. Same thing with an actor in an ad. You gotta feel it, you gotta move it, and then you gonna be moved by it. And then, and then yet creators can maybe be kind of somewhere in the middle, right? You kinda give them guidance, but, uh, let them do their own thing. Uh, maybe you give 'em a script, maybe you don't, uh, but they're usually comfortable on camera, which, which is really, which is really handy. So, um, love that. Let's talk a little bit about what are the keys to finding good creators. So, you know, there's millions now of creators and influencers out there. How do we find the right creator for our brand?

Danil:

Yeah, I think like one of the, uh, another, uh, thought that, uh, I would like to bring, uh, not every creator is an influencer. Not every influencer is the creator. Yeah,

Brett:

Great. So, great. Yeah.

Danil:

It's, it's is the thing that we learned for the past, like few years when we realized, okay, there is an influencer, uh, she or he has like, you know, a million of followers great, right? So like, uh, it's definitely resonates. Something more, more over, like engagement is there, but the point is that when you ask this person, like to create some content for ads, completely fail. So they're really great for the organic, uh, info marketing. So just ask them to create some content, but not for ads, because they don't understand like this, the, your creative brief, which is like kindish, uh, script, right? So like, what, what you asking? Like what is the problem you would like to highlight in, in the video and how you, how your product is gonna be, uh, solved that. So, um, that's like one of the statement, right? So that's why we are really focusing on those micro influencers or our creators.

They are able to produce like great content, uh, and the following, it's more like a social proof. That's like one of the thing. Uh, secondly, uh, about the how to choose the right creator for you, uh, for your brand. So I'll start with the just, uh, just the basic metrics like, uh, first of all, platform, right? Uh, what is the pla, are they good, like on this platform, content that they produce, like on this content, easy to resonate to the audience or not? So meaning that you have like some, uh, engagement rates or number of the views, so like this basement that are just to try to understand whether it's like this person is able to produce great content for this platform or not. Secondly, definitely about the, uh, video resumes or portfolio. So what is the branded content, uh, this person produced? Like for, for the br for the brands before, just take a look, uh, and understand like whether they able to speak about your brands or not.

Uh, and definitely like about categories and like, uh, uh, they audiences. So the way how our customers approach like way different, right? So like, uh, on all platform, you can start the, your campaign like in different ways, uh, with the different filters. So the most common is that, uh, I will just select the platform, then I will select, uh, gender if, if it matters, uh, where this person is located. Super important because, uh, probably I need to ship my product. And, uh, if this person located in somewhere like in Germany and, uh, we don't have the shipping process, then like, it might be problem, uh, then like, where's the audience of this, uh, influencer is located? Just understand like whether it's resonates with the audience, uh, like Indus for instance. Um, and then like a category like beauty blogger or like, uh, instant, right? So that's, that's the niche category that just underst like what is gonna be like, uh, works or not.

And then like, once you selected the, uh, the, all of these paras, then, uh, the next, uh, the next stage is just to get like some video rhythms or like, uh, take a look on the, uh, their portfolio, understand what is the, uh, if the content is, uh, great, uh, fit for your brand or not. And then, uh, chat with them, like ask the questions, uh, and understand like whether they, uh, want to work with you, uh, just for money or they love your product, like, uh, and then, uh, they would like to be compensated for their work.

Brett:

Yeah, that's really good. And so, so of course this is not just a snap your fingers process and it all happens, right? You need to look at what is someone's video resume as a creator? Are they creating content that that really feels and looks authentic in a particular platform, whatever platform you are trying to, to advertise on. And then, yeah, have that dialogue and see do they really love the product or do they love just getting paid and being an influencer? Uh, nothing wrong with getting paid, but you really want someone who loves the product and loves the brand that's gonna be much more authentic. So, uh, I wanna talk a little bit about how do we set a creator up to succeed? Uh, because, you know, you and I were talking about this before you hit record. Sometimes you watch a movie and you think that person's not a very good actor. Yeah. But really that's not, not the problem. The problem is the script and the director and the direction this person was given, and maybe they only could do one take and then they moved on, right? So maybe it's not just the actor, maybe it's the, the person behind the scenes. So as a brand, how do we set up a creator to really create great stuff?

Danil:

Yeah, great question. And uh, your example, like, just to remind me, like this situation would be, uh, one of the actor, uh, in the last series of, uh, Star Wars kbi, right? Yeah. So like, uh, people like starting blaming, like, uh, actor about like, uh, she's not acting like well as and so on, but I believe that, uh, there is a question to the script. There is a question to the director <laugh>, like, not to her, right? So that's why like, it's, uh, definitely resonates, uh, about like, yeah, ask, uh, start asking the questions. Uh, and the key is that definitely,

Brett:

And another another analogy is sports too, right? Like, there, there could be one player that that just kills it on one team, but then they go to a different environment with a different coach and a different everything, and they're no longer good, right? So it's like you gotta create the environment for someone to succeed.

Danil:

Absolutely. Like messy, right? So like, he was a rockstar, like best player, like ever in Barcelona. He's still like great player like, uh, in psg, but like, he's not that not

Brett:

The same level.

Danil:

Yeah, not the same level because the environment is different. Yeah. So, uh, I would say like with the, when you're working with the creators, like it's super important. The creative brief, creative brief is 52% of the success, uh, meaning that you can hire like great creators. But again, like if the creative brief, uh, it's not clear, then uh, you gonna be probably failing. So that's why like we are really, uh, putting like a lot of attention of our customers towards the creative brief. And then like if the, uh, team is not, uh, well educated, we actually spend like a couple of, uh, hours to educate them how to create, uh, good creative briefs, uh, while we, they, while we're onboarding. So there are like a few things, uh, that you need to think about. So one of them is a campaign type. So do you want to get like, just content or you want to ask influencer to post this content?

And then also to boost this content in paid. So like there are like different ways of the, uh, of the campaigns. Also the content formats, uh, formats are like, uh, nine, 16 or just square, uh, landscape. So super important. And then, um, also like just the technical question about the lights, about the sound. So sometimes it's important, sometimes, uh, uh, you are requesting, uh, to film something like in bathroom, for instance, if it comes to the beauty, uh, product and then like, because of the echo, uh, it might be like not the great results if you're feeling that on just iPhone, right? So that's why like it's, uh, like some technical require. You should have like some professional mic, for instance. Uh, that's kind of stuff. Uh, and they then like, uh, the content type and messaging. So like, uh, what exactly you are asking about, um, um, about like just the content, like it's, is it like unboxing video?

Is it like a product demo? If it's like, uh, selfie testimonial. So something that, uh, gonna be explaining how you actually should, should, uh, um, do like this content and then like, uh, the, the, the next, uh, the next, uh, step, like actually what they should do, right? Uh, just like it's a raw footage or it's ready to use ads. Is it like, uh, what is the length of this video and like what exactly you need to do, like showcase the box and unbox the products with attention to details or, uh, show close up of the product, interact with the product, or no, uh, no music, nature, light or like artificial one. So like, yeah, there are like so many questions you, it's better to outline there though, do not beat crazy with so many bullets, because, uh, still remember they are freelancers, they're creators and their creative people.

So yeah, just the most important things. Um, and then, uh, key products, uh, features, uh, like why your product is the best one, right? Help creators to understand that because okay, I tried, I like it the taste, for instance. Uh, but like, then I have no idea why it's so good. So I like hair issue, salt. I always struggled with that's like number one, or, uh, thicker hair instantly. It has never been, uh, this easy to make my hair look thicker, right? So like, that's kind of stuff like you need to drop like, and help, uh, creators as the, again, like, not the scripted text, but more about like the guidance and direction.

Brett:

Nice.

Danil:

Um,

Brett:

So you're recommending more bullet points or one liners, things like that, rather than fully scripting out something?

Danil:

Yes, for sure. Like direction. So you can, you, you can ask like, to say like something specifically if that the part of the program, but like, do not the script, the entire, uh, video. Like, please, it's a, it's not, it doesn't work great with, uh, creators. It does work, uh, great with actors <laugh>, right? Sometimes. Yeah. And the last thing is like, uh, it, uh, just like I touch some, uh, script examples and references, uh, something like that.

Brett:

Yeah. So show, show some other, like, I really love the way this creator did this or love this example. Anytime we can share examples, that's good. Yeah.

Danil:

Yeah. So like for instance, like if you just starting and you don't have like, any references for your brand, right? So in that case, you can take a look on new comparisons or like similar products and then saying like, Okay, I this, like, this is my reference. That's how I feel, uh, you should talk about my brand. So this one like is really important. And the last thing is like a super simple, it's dos and don's. So, uh, show different angles, clear audio or like face should be fully in the camera frame. So that kind of stuff. And don't, like, don't sound like an net. My favorite one. Yeah. Uh, don't use, uh, too many shadows. Don't use filters while filming, because some of the creators, they're using filters, the, uh, Instagram filters, right? Like, while they, they crazy. No, please don't. So yeah, that's kind of, uh, suggestion. Uh, I would give

Brett:

Love that so much. And I think it, it's, you really made it clear like, hey, give direction. Don't leave questions unanswered, but also don't be crazy, right? Gi give, uh, preferences for things that matter, but at the end of the day, we want the creator to be authentic and the creator's gonna be authentic if they can put some of their own style towards this. But, but show them kind of what you want them to say and where they need to be and lighting in some of those tips. But, uh, but give enough, but don't go overboard. I think, uh, would be a way to summarize that. So that's awesome. Uh, just a couple more questions. That's been amazing, Daniel, and we, uh, really, really appreciate it. But, um, what do people need to know about TikTok? TikTok is obviously hot, everybody's talking about it, a few people understand it, I think. So what are the differences with TikTok content versus other platforms?

Danil:

Yeah. Um, it's, uh, it's interesting even though like, uh, TikTok is saying like they, they're kind of like outline is make TikTok is not at Yeah. And I think like that's actually explains like a lot of things Yep. Because, uh, TikTok is a way different platform. Uh, first of all is a, a creator plus platform, meaning that without creators, this pla platform is nothing without creators like Instagram. Uh, we'll survive with the memes, you know, like, and, uh, other like portals. But like, not gonna be like that successful Facebook, for instance, like without creators easy, right? So that's why like, it's, it's so different. Um, another thing like about TikTok, um, people think about like TikTok, it's only for my kids.

Brett:

Yeah.

Danil:

It's not anymore. Like they're all like, uh, a lot of people and the majority of the people at the age of, uh, where they can make decision and purchase the product, meaning that like 20 plus age old, age old, right? And then, uh, they also, um, so many elder generation like actually joined TikTok and found that like, it's, uh, it's my place to go. Another funny thing that what I heard like from, uh, geek out, uh, folks like from the last one in Barcelona, TikTok becoming like the internet for, uh, Gen Z, meaning that they're interesting, they're Google it. They're yeah,

Brett:

Yeah. They're searching on TikTok for things, right? Yeah. Right,

Danil:

Right. And so like

Brett:

Crazy,

Danil:

Their, their request starting with a TikTok, like, do you need to find, like where, uh, would, I would like to, to order like a food, go to TikTok, go to

Brett:

TikTok,

Danil:

Uh, restaurant TikTok. So like, they google it on TikTok, so they toing <laugh>. So

Brett:

Google, Google really appreciates that language where they Google it on TikTok, but Yeah, but it's happy I've heard that too. People start like, yeah, people start on TikTok, which is super interesting.

Danil:

Yeah. So, uh, it's, uh, and also like, it's fascinating to see like that, uh, TikTok took only five years to reach out to reach a, the 1 billion user mark, like just five years. It's like, it's crazy. And like 130 million are active users in the us so it's a massive audience, just massive.

Brett:

Massive, Yeah. Uh, yeah. And, and it's super interesting. Like for me, my, my own journey with TikTok as a user, it wasn't my, my favorite platform. In fact, when I first used it, I, I honestly hated it that I, the stuff I was saying, I was like one of my, like a 13 year old boy, like, what am I looking at? Uh, but then someone was like, Hey, no, no, no, just, just like search for things you like, click on things you like. And now my feet is actually pretty good. It's all like sports and business and comedy and stuff, which is really fun. I still don't use it that much. I'm more like of an Instagram user and a YouTube user, just, just, um, that's what I enjoy. But, um, yeah, TikTok is exploded and it can't be ignored. You gotta look into it.

Um, gotta use it. So, uh, so yeah, but it's really interesting. It is a creator first platform that's, that's super interesting. Whereas Facebook, Matt is people, you know, just people on, on on Facebook. But TikTok is all about the, the creator. Totally makes sense. So, um, let, let's talk about this, Uh, Daniel, let's, let's talk about incense. And so you, you've kind of highlighted a little bit as we've gone what you guys do, but, but really, who, who is this marketplace for? So, so what types of brands, uh, can really benefit from the marketplace and, and kind of walk through what, what is the experience like of using incense to, to find the, the right creators?

Danil:

Right. Uh, so we are creator marketplace, meaning that like, we are really only the transaction between the, uh, creator and the marketer, uh, and helping you to make it happen. And, uh, I would say like our ideal customer profile is, uh, midsize commerce. So, uh, we have like, great now five, uh, hundred brands, uh, and 90% of them are e-commerce. So we love, uh, working with the e-commerce, it's like, it's our bread and butter. So we're doing like a lot of integration with method. You talk easy

Brett:

To get, easy to get creators to talk about like physical products, right? Creators like to talk about yes. Stuff and like to unbox and do some of those fun things more than a, you know, an info product or something like that

Danil:

Ex. Exactly. And like that's one was one of the key reasons. So why we, uh, felt it's better to work with the e-commerce brands because like people, creators, they love working with the e-commerce because they always getting like some new products to test out and see. And also e-commerce brands, they innovators, like I know Mushroom industry, right? So like mushroom milk, Have you ever heard about that? I never thought about that. Right? So, but it is a thing, and you can try this out or like mushroom tea or whatever. Like

Brett:

There is, I drink, I drink a mushroom tea almost every afternoon, just finished one before I recorded this. And I, and I put mushroom creamer in my coffee now, so I don't understand mm-hmm. <affirmative>.

Danil:

Yeah, it just like a so niche products that, uh, e-commerce brands, they, they, they created like every other day. So, and for the creators, they have the access to try this out and like, uh, super early. And then like, uh, with that, it's so easy to explain what is, what is this about? Because, uh, the other, like, small part of our customers, primarily it's mobile apps and, uh, digital native products. And I would say like, sometimes it's so hard to explain about this product and like actually show page that in a, in a authentic way and not like as the app, like for instance, if it's a yoga app, so easy, right? But like, if it's coming like some FinTech product, b2 C completely, like, it looks like cheesy, like when you explain

Brett:

Explaining an app in authentic way is way different than saying, do this my favorite new cream, put my coffee, check it out. Like that's, that's easy. Yeah, yeah,

Danil:

Yeah. So that's why like, we love working with a, with the e-commerce and like, uh, I would say like, we are the best, like for those e-commerce brands that are at, at the stage of scaling. So they, they should spend like some, like thousands of dollars like on ads spend, like Facebook, uh, YouTube, uh, Instagram, uh, TikTok and so on. So buying media and for that they need a lot of s to test out and see like, what is the winners and put the entire budget there. So in that case, like that's the best customers for us.

Brett:

That's fantastic. Cool. And so where those that, that are interested, they wanna find out more, uh, where should they go online to, to learn?

Danil:

Well, uh, my place to go is Twitter. So there are e-commerce marketers, uh, like Nick Shackle fold, uh, Jambo, uh, who are chatting and like posting a lot of stuff like around, uh, creators, u GC and wan, uh, definitely like Twitter and hashtag u gc. So, uh, you can find like a lot of great stuff there. Uh, also you can, uh, go to our blog post, uh,

Brett:

A great blog.

Danil:

Yeah, we're trying to shame that, like being really helpful to community. So what we learn from customers, actually almost every piece of the content there, it's like, it's coming from our partners, so our customers when we're just practically listening them and like then putting together like all thoughts there.

Brett:

Yep. That's great. So incense.pro, and that's i n s e n s e dot p r o. So check that out, check out the blog. Awesome stuff. Great service. Daniel, you're just super smart. Love talking to you. Thanks for being, uh, so open and so, so generous with your ideas. And, uh, now can people follow you on the socials? Are you active on any of those platforms sharing your knowledge or are you mainly sharing on, on the blog?

Danil:

Well, uh, great question. So like, I'm active, but, and I was active and still active on LinkedIn. I love this platform and, uh, everyone told me ex uh, including geek out folks that you should be, uh, on Twitter and I give up on Twitter in 2013. Yeah. So I can, That's what

Brett:

Everybody's like, Yeah, yeah. I, I on Twitter a long time ago, but like everybody's on Twitter now. Uh, I still have not like developed, um, a routine of getting on Twitter and checking stuff. But yeah, I know like Nick Shackleford and others are posting constantly on, on Twitter and posting some really good stuff. I just have not developed a habit of fully, fully being there. I'm, I'm more on Facebook, ig, I'm on LinkedIn some and then, and then of course YouTube. So, uh, Daniel, this has been fantastic, man. Thank you so much for doing this and we'll, we'll have to do it again sometime.

Danil:

Thanks so much, Brad, for much game. Awesome.

Brett:

It was, Thank you. You bet. And as always, thank you for listening. We'd love to hear from you. What do you like about the show? Uh, hey, leave that review on iTunes if you haven't already. Makes my day and helps other people find the show as well. And so with that, until next time, thank you for listening.

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